“I’ve been, so one of my writer friends who I published, a guy called Ian Curnow, he was one of the producers behind “Never Gonna Give You Up” by Rick Astley and “Stay Another Day” by East 17 and Kylie. He was a big producer, and I took him to Eurovision. He was the first person I went with, and he turned to me and said, ‘This is the biggest thing I’ve ever done.’ And I’m sitting there thinking, ‘But you were number one in America with Rick Astley.’ Yet he’s saying that he meant the show. The show was, ‘I’ve never been, it’s like the Olympics. It’s that big.’ And then you want to go back every year. Every time I take someone new, they’re like, ‘I’ll come back next year. I’m trying to get in next year.’” – Greig Watts
This episode’s guest is one half of the UK-based writing, production and publishing team DWB, and in recent years, he’s successfully hosted several songwriting camps, catering to Asia and Eurovision. The triumph of these camps and the songs they produced has established him as an expert in the fields of songwriting for the Eurovision Song Contest. Since 2016, he’s supervised eighteen Eurovision entries across eleven consecutive years, along with approximately 80 national finalists within that time frame. His expertise has also led to him becoming a sought-after conference speaker, panelist, and moderator; he was the Music Consultant for Eurovision for the BBC for 2019, and he’s just released his first book, Keeping the Dream Alive, which has already become an Amazon bestseller.
In this conversation, we explore the moments when he nearly walked away from music, the power of reconnecting with the sounds that first moved him, and why he believes creativity is less about ego and more about connection. His name is Greig Watts, and we talk about using Eurovision as a strategic launchpad and how understanding the business of music can protect the soul of it. If you’ve wondered how sound becomes strategy, or how resilience turns into resonance, this episode is for you.
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(00:00) – Greig’s Transition to Songwriting
Our conversation starts off with Greig’s early memories of sound, particularly how, as a toddler, Manfred Mann’s “Do Wah Diddy Diddy” became part of the soundtrack of his life. “Whenever I hear that song,” he explains, “my great-grandmother Goodman pops back into my head, and I can only have been three at the time, but it’s a real, definite memory, and I think I’ve got lots of those memories.” Greig tells us how his career in sound began, including how he turned down a record deal as the lead singer to follow his true passion. “What I really wanted was the songwriting,” he tells us. “It wasn’t to be a front person… I was kind of getting engaged to my first wife, and I was like, I don’t really want to go to Japan and be a front person in a band. I want to be a songwriter.”
(14:05) – Eurovision and the Global Market
Greig tells us about his work with Eurovision and what it’s taught him about bringing new musical acts to the world. “We organized our own songwriting camp,” he recalls, “and asked people to come. Probably had thirty people out there, and that’s how we got our first entry for Norway. And since then, we’ve had an entry every year, and actually we’ve had 18 entries in 11 years.” We discuss his work with boy bands, J-pop, and K-pop artists, and how the international pop scene’s shifted in recent years. “Japanese [artists] don’t tend to come out of Japan so much,” he explains. “It’s a big market, they’re not so bothered about that. But Korean culture, the government is funding Korean culture coming out. That’s why we’re getting, you know, Squid Game. That’s why we get lots of Korean films.”
(28:41) – Greig’s Reflections on Creativity
We discuss how Greig’s career almost took a turn away from sound, and what it took to bring him back into the industry. “Eventually, I kind of felt I needed to take a year off,” he tells us, “but I wasn’t going to say that. I kind of knew it, and eventually, about two years later, my wife said, ‘You need to finish now. You need to go and take a year off.’” He talks about his foray into banking, and the breakthrough that cemented his career as a songwriter. “We did say, give me a year and if I’m not making money by the end of the year, then I go back to the bank… On month twelve, I got offered a job to set up a publishing department of a record label, which meant as a songwriter, I suddenly had income.”
Episode Summary
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Greig’s shift from band member to songwriter and music consultant.
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His insights into the Asian music market and its dynamics.
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Our discussion on how sound influences our feelings and memories.
Tune in for next week’s episode as we discuss the valuable lessons his grandfather shared with him and others in his life, how neurodiversity can almost be an advantage when it comes to certain industries, and why being the best songwriter doesn’t necessarily lead to the most success.
Connect with the Guest
Website: https://www.dwbmusicgroup.com/
Follow Greig Watts on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/greig.watts/
Follow Greig Watts on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/greigwatts/
Follow Greig Watts on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/greigwatts/
Subscribe to Greig Watts on TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@greigwatts/
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This interview episode was very skillfully made to sound beautiful by the talented Humberto Franco.
** Transcript available upon request
